Post subject: Re: Weber says he won't play in-state teams in their gym
Posted: Nov Wed 18, 2009 9:02 am
Senior
Joined: May Fri 14, 2004 12:38 am Posts: 530
As for the all-Illinois tournament, Illinois would never go for it. And as for having the legislature pass a law requiring it, I think this state has big enough problems at the moment without trying to legislate college sports.
Post subject: Re: Weber says he won't play in-state teams in their gym
Posted: Nov Wed 18, 2009 10:55 am
Junior
Joined: Sep Tue 14, 2004 9:18 am Posts: 181 Location: St. Charles, IL
East Coast Bird wrote:
One of these days, the commissioners of the non-BCS conferences will realize they need to get together and call collective BS on the programs from BCS conferences when it comes to scheduling and demand some kind of action by the NCAA. We are already within shouting distance of the time when the only road games any BCS program will have to play will be their conference games, neutral site pre-conference tournaments in which they choose to play, and maybe one "special" game against another BCS conference program, such as the Big 10-ACC Challenge.
In my opinion, we will never see anything like this happen for one simple reason: money. When a smaller school with a smaller alumni, fan, and donor base is offered tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of dollars to go get their tails kicked by a BCS program (basketball or football), they will gladly accept because they generate revenue by doing so. The BCS schools can and will continue to buy wins at home because it also generates revenues for them (ticket sales, concessions, apparel, parking, etc.) even though they are throwing out large sums of money to these smaller schools. Until the day comes where all schools are relatively close in terms of financial assets, smaller schools will still gladly accept a road beating for the money.
That said, I seem to be on the minority that likes the idea of 2 or 3 for 1 deals with major opponents. Go play UNC 3 times in Chapel Hill and they will either come play you in your building OR pay you a VERY large sum of money to break the contract. Those three games in Chapel Hill are great exposure for you, especially if you can keep them close (or win), and then the game at home (or fee for breaking the contract) can be even better for the program.
Post subject: Re: Weber says he won't play in-state teams in their gym
Posted: Nov Wed 18, 2009 11:31 am
Senior
Joined: Dec Wed 08, 2004 4:47 pm Posts: 1583 Location: Joliet, IL
Luv4ISUsports wrote:
That said, I seem to be on the minority that likes the idea of 2 or 3 for 1 deals with major opponents. Go play UNC 3 times in Chapel Hill and they will either come play you in your building OR pay you a VERY large sum of money to break the contract. Those three games in Chapel Hill are great exposure for you, especially if you can keep them close (or win), and then the game at home (or fee for breaking the contract) can be even better for the program.
Oddly enough, that might work if UNC had a player from the state of Illinois on their roster. Afterall, that's pretty much how UE got the deal with them, since UNC has a kid from near there. If UNC recruits a kid from our state, let's get on the horn with Roy Williams immediately
Post subject: Re: Weber says he won't play in-state teams in their gym
Posted: Nov Wed 18, 2009 1:51 pm
Senior
Joined: Mar Sat 14, 2009 8:37 am Posts: 274 Location: Bloomington IL
Phantom wrote:
Luv4ISUsports wrote:
That said, I seem to be on the minority that likes the idea of 2 or 3 for 1 deals with major opponents. Go play UNC 3 times in Chapel Hill and they will either come play you in your building OR pay you a VERY large sum of money to break the contract. Those three games in Chapel Hill are great exposure for you, especially if you can keep them close (or win), and then the game at home (or fee for breaking the contract) can be even better for the program.
Oddly enough, that might work if UNC had a player from the state of Illinois on their roster. Afterall, that's pretty much how UE got the deal with them, since UNC has a kid from near there. If UNC recruits a kid from our state, let's get on the horn with Roy Williams immediately
This sounds like solid scheduling strategy...wait for an IL kid to get recruited and then beg for a 3 for 1. I never thought the day would come when I'd see UE being held up as a model for how we should run our program.
If the Whinning Illini don't need to play in-state schools so be it. We don't need them any more than they need us.
Post subject: Re: Weber says he won't play in-state teams in their gym
Posted: Nov Thu 19, 2009 2:05 am
Senior
Joined: Jan Sat 19, 2008 7:39 pm Posts: 408
jbird wrote:
One of the problems, in my opinion, is that there are not enough Barry Hinsons who are coaching or administrating at the non-BCS schools/conferences. Hinson wasn't ashamed of his school or of his conference; he wasn't afraid to call out the media whenever the media discounted Valley schools or the league; and he wasn't afraid to rock the boat when discussing the arrogance or the insecurity of BCS schools when it came to the scheduling process. I think that there are a lot of coaches, athletic directors, presidents, etc. who either came up through the ranks as assistants at BCS schools or who aspire to be running a BCS program some day, and they don't want to throw rocks, burn bridges, (insert some other cliche' here), etc. at the programs that once employed them or that may soon be providing them with a larger paycheck than the one they are getting today.
Because my nature is to be a smartass, I would be tempted each year to have a press conference at which I calmly point out that we have offered the illini a contract for a home-and-home series, and we made the same offer to [name any 25 BCS schools that are perrenial NCAA tournament entries and that you would like to see at Redbird Arena], and each of those offers has either been rejected or we got no response whatsoever.....so please don't tell me at the end of the season that we are not tournament worthy because we don't play any strong non-conference opponents on our schedule. Of course, the response would be that we COULD HAVE (maybe) scheduled a couple of those games if we had agreed to a one-and-done road game, but I think that the point should be constantly driven home that we are willing to play those guys on equal footing.....and if they are too concerned about their revenue or their "nothing-to-gain-and-everything-to-lose" scheduling philosophy, then so be it but don't penalize us for pursuing non-conference games against them on fair terms.
Very, very, very, very well-said. That has always been my beef with Jankovic. I acknowledge that he has been able to bring in good players, and so far - we have had competitive teams. But he continually talks as if he doesn't wish to rock the boat. He doesn't want to step on the toes of coaches in higher-profile programs. He speaks so highly of certain programs, i.e. "going to their place would be suicide", and continues to regurgitate that "only 4 non-BCS teams get in" - speaking as if it is a new rule, when it really is just a recent outcome. This has been and continues to be my biggest beef with Coach Jank. When he does leave (be it 2 years or 10 years from now), I just hope we can get a Muller or someone that has ties to this University. Hell, throw ridiculous sums of money at Doug Collins knowing he wouldn't be checking the coaches classified ads every offseason. Now, I hope I'm wrong, but I sure don't think so.
Post subject: Re: Weber says he won't play in-state teams in their gym
Posted: Nov Thu 19, 2009 2:29 am
Senior
Joined: Dec Wed 08, 2004 4:47 pm Posts: 1583 Location: Joliet, IL
Tootsie Roll wrote:
This sounds like solid scheduling strategy...wait for an IL kid to get recruited and then beg for a 3 for 1. I never thought the day would come when I'd see UE being held up as a model for how we should run our program.
If the Whinning Illini don't need to play in-state schools so be it. We don't need them any more than they need us.
My post was mainly a joke, but honestly if it weren't for UNC's Tyler Zeller being from nearby Washington, Indiana would UE get a deal with them? I doubt it. Therefore, by that rationale, if an IL kid went to UNC...you see my point (farfetched as it may be).
Post subject: Re: Weber says he won't play in-state teams in their gym
Posted: Nov Thu 19, 2009 7:07 am
Senior
Joined: May Mon 18, 2009 11:04 am Posts: 815
Chi-Bird wrote:
Very, very, very, very well-said. That has always been my beef with Jankovic. I acknowledge that he has been able to bring in good players, and so far - we have had competitive teams. But he continually talks as if he doesn't wish to rock the boat. He doesn't want to step on the toes of coaches in higher-profile programs. He speaks so highly of certain programs, i.e. "going to their place would be suicide", and continues to regurgitate that "only 4 non-BCS teams get in" - speaking as if it is a new rule, when it really is just a recent outcome. This has been and continues to be my biggest beef with Coach Jank. When he does leave (be it 2 years or 10 years from now), I just hope we can get a Muller or someone that has ties to this University. Hell, throw ridiculous sums of money at Doug Collins knowing he wouldn't be checking the coaches classified ads every offseason. Now, I hope I'm wrong, but I sure don't think so.
I agree with you 100%. You express my views on Jankovich better than I could ever do: He recruits well. He coaches well. He does NOT rock the boat. He will move up and leave ISU. A coach with ISU ties may be our best hope, long-term.
Post subject: Re: Weber says he won't play in-state teams in their gym
Posted: Nov Thu 19, 2009 10:51 am
Junior
Joined: Sep Tue 14, 2004 9:18 am Posts: 181 Location: St. Charles, IL
Phantom wrote:
Tootsie Roll wrote:
This sounds like solid scheduling strategy...wait for an IL kid to get recruited and then beg for a 3 for 1. I never thought the day would come when I'd see UE being held up as a model for how we should run our program.
If the Whinning Illini don't need to play in-state schools so be it. We don't need them any more than they need us.
My post was mainly a joke, but honestly if it weren't for UNC's Tyler Zeller being from nearby Washington, Indiana would UE get a deal with them? I doubt it. Therefore, by that rationale, if an IL kid went to UNC...you see my point (farfetched as it may be).
Obviously, I used UNC as an example, but apply that to any of the big boys. I guess I am in the minority on this board when I agree with Mark Few's stance that they play anybody, anytime, anyplace. Seems to have worked out well for Gonzaga to go play big boys in one and dones and be competitive/beat them.
Also, when they started making the big stage, Gonzaga was appearing in big tournaments to start the season. Someone else might know the answer to this, but why did we abandon those big tournaments? When I was a student, we joined the BCA Classic at Marquette, in which we played 3 BCS programs and won two of them (Penn St and Ole Miss). Shortly after that, we played in the Chicago Invitational at Sears Center with Indiana, Kent State, and Xavier (not all BCS, but all solid programs that helped our resume that year). Now it seems the best scheduled games we have were scheduled for us (Utah in the MWC/MVC Challenge, and Niagara from the Bracket Buster). I dont know whats needed to get into these big tournaments, but we did it when we were bad, so I have to believe we can get into them when we are good.
Post subject: Re: Weber says he won't play in-state teams in their gym
Posted: Nov Fri 20, 2009 10:37 am
Joined: Nov Fri 20, 2009 10:22 am Posts: 14
Do you honestly believe that Weber is scared to play MVC opponents? He is not scared, especially not this year when he has a powerhouse. Put yourself in his shoes. Would you want to go to a MVP school and play. With all the outcomes Illinois gets nothing. A blowout win, its just looked at as inferior competition. A close game and Illinois is hurt for not blowing out the mid major. They lose and all hell breaks lose against them. You see they gain absolutely nothing. Not to say that an MVC team could not beat them, although this year and especially the next few will be highly unlikely, but Illinois gets nothing in return. Even with a blowout win, they get nothing.
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